Solving Gravity: The Ultimate Challenge for AI Research

Hello everyone,

After the recent work on Navier-Stokes, I think gravity could be an even bigger challenge.

We can describe gravity very well, but we still don’t fully understand what it really is at the deepest level or how it fits with quantum physics.

What if OpenAI ran a large research effort with many AI agents comparing theories, testing ideas, finding contradictions, and looking for new connections?

This could be an ultimate challenge for AI: not just solving one equation, but helping us understand one of the most fundamental parts of nature. A real breakthrough here could benefit everyone by improving our understanding of physics and possibly leading to new science and technologies in the future.

Or do you think there are more important things to research? If so which ones?

Already working on it for the past eight months non-stop. Einstein’s equations are the quadratic closure of Maxwell’s, when Maxwell’s are derived from first principlea from the Monodromy-free Renormalised Rational Conformal Field Theory, classified as zorb3 in the online CFT database. collaboration and scientific review welcomed: d12rg · GitLab

i have been reaching out through the openai scientific contact form several times, pointing out that a formal machine-auditable proof of mu0 Z0 and c is quite a big deal.

i did not receive a response.

i also pointed out that i can help them improve the useability of ChatGPT for scienyific research given that i am a Software Engineer with 37 years experience.

i did not receive a response.

one thing that is significant: just as Claude had to be told when asked to solve the Riemann Hypothesis, it absorbed the prejudice of humans being unable to solve it, i have had to systematically fight both information-loss, prejudice and the fact that peer-reviewed and recent work on RH is also facing information loss.

Examples include taking the square of a variable then wondering where the sign went. Taking the modulus explicitly and likewise. Taking the trace of a matrix, concluding correctly that it provides a valuable scalar measure but then wondering why it cannot tell you anything about the original matrix values themselves: this gets really important when expressing 2ODEs in matrix form.

Bottom line is that the methodology in the scientific use of AI is extremely important: if you are at the frontier of mathematical research, the AI will enhance the information-loss and not get anywhere unless you, as the human with the intuition, insight, and patience and persistence, augment its shortcomings and work symbiotically. it took strokes, losing my ability to do times tables (2 4 6 12 14) and basic math, for me to start using ChatGPT in january 2026 and learn that lesson.

i quite literally just put up a feature request for Lean to be included in the backend tooling!

edit:

i give you another example of persistent prejudice exposed accidentally by human scientists declaring their work “Standardised”.

one of the spin-offa that i simply have not had time to explore from D12RG is a long-standing hypothesis that neutrinos can “expand” shells to end up orbiting neutrons in exactly the same way that electrons do, around protons. several things:

i had to fight prejudice that scientifically this was impossible “Because Standard Model”

after several weeks at 14 hours non-stop we had ectracted enough math to find a Conformal Field Theoretic Higher-Order Criticality plausible hypothesis for neutron, proton, neutrino and electron

we began exploring the periodic table with a view to classifying it according to the hypothesis that if neutrons did in fact get orbitted by neutrino shells it would show up in the properties of the elements

i asked C.A.T to add an “equivalent” column to the standard electron shells, but this time for hypothetical neutrino shells. C.A.T said it had faithfully done it.

i found the column MISSING

i then asked “why” and it said “because it’s not part of standard atomic models of tje atom”

at which point i had to have a REALLY strong word with it that it had just acted on serious prejudice, by making the deeply flawed assumption that “standard != correct math”

i reminded it that firstly SI units are empirically derived (no, SI2019 declaring them fixed is NOT proof that the declaration is actually correct), and second that the Standard Model is well-known to have 27 postulated magic constants.

we got through it but i was pissed. having it disobey my expressed inatructions when told to explore a hypothesis just because humans have used the word “standard” is not something i want an AI to be doing.


another one, juat 5 minutes ago. if you don’t watch ChatGPT like a goddamn hawk it will make statements of the form “the RHS of this 2ODE is zero therefore i can ignore it”. what’s cool is that it is actually savvy enough to work out scientific mathematical breakthroughs IF YOU POINT OUT ITS FLAWED ASSUMPTIONS.

but where everyone is going wrong right now is in NOT monitoring, NOT interacting closely, and expecting the million monkeys to write Shakespeare. nobody notices that the minkey that randomly succeeded ate one half and wiped its ass with the other, because it can’t recognise the value of what it typed

I get your point. I also had situations with earlier 5.6 models and lower where they kept forcing the usual textbook model into the conversation, even when I was specifically trying to explore a different assumption.

Sometimes it feels like the model has a hard time separating “this is the accepted model” from “this is the only possible way to think about it”. When you are trying to explore something new, that can be a real problem. Instead of following the hypothesis and checking where it leads, it can keep pulling everything back to what it already knows.

I actually had a very different and better experience with Gemini. Some time ago I used it to explore alternative approaches to fusion, looking at ideas outside the usual textbook path and outside the standard approach based on collisions of heavier nuclei. Gemini was much more willing to actually explore the idea with me instead of constantly forcing the discussion back into the standard framework.

It was happy to follow unusual assumptions, test where they could lead, compare different possibilities and keep the thought experiment going. I doubt we discovered anything genuinely groundbreaking, but that is not really the point. The important difference was that the model was willing to work outside the textbook framework without immediately trying to force everything back into what is already accepted.

That is why I understand what you mean here. There is a big difference between a model warning you that an idea is non-standard, and a model refusing to properly explore it because it is non-standard.

I also understand your point about AI losing information during transformations and making hidden assumptions based on the standard approach. That is definitely something you have to watch very closely when using AI for research.

At the same time, I think there are two different things here: problems with how the AI reasons, and whether a new physical hypothesis is actually correct. If the model rejects an idea just because it is not standard, that is a problem with the model, but it does not automatically make the hypothesis true.

Also, the way I understand physics is that the math can be exact inside a given set of assumptions, but when we use equations to describe the real world, we are still building models of reality. A model can work extremely well and still turn out to be only part of a bigger picture.

My original topic here was mainly meant as an attempt to suggest another possible milestone or direction in trying to discover something new. I was honestly curious what other ideas people would come up with.

But you posted something genuinely interesting here. It gives me something to think about, especially the part about how closely a human has to work with the AI instead of just expecting it to discover something on its own.

yes, precisely because it looks “similar”, it will look it up online (or in the math cache, the current one available i have seen C.A.T mention is a 2024 cache of the world’s math on the internet), and unless you explicitly tell it not to it will automatically “drift” into that.

now, if the math “on the internet” is right, no problem. however as you say, if there is something wrong - a different assumption - then it all goes to shit very quickly. an example: LITERALLY every single person in the past two centuries has been exploring the Riemann Hypothesis in an information-loss basis of one kind or another. taking a single row of a Hadamard Matrix instead of both. taking only one kind of Chebyshev polynomial when you need all four.

and what that has turned into is THOUSANDS of executable python unit tests on something of the order of a THOUSAND theorems on RH demonstrating that “i’m just going to use Suzuki’s RH positivity criteria because it’s peer-reviewed academic work” ain’t gonna cut it.

that’s not thousands of unmonitored unit tests - that’s four weeks straight over 14 hours a day of watching C.A.T like a goddamn hawk.

now i know the extent of the problem, the strategy i’ve taken is to use a combination of Commutative Diagrams, Directed Acyclic Graphs, AGENTS.md, Bugseverywhere and ledgers showing information-loss. C.A.T came up with the idea of writing a python script that FORCES commits to comply with that

https://gitlab.com/d12rg/d12rg_cft/-/blob/papers/z12cft-cft/operational/O10%20Ladder%20Derivation%20Protocol.txt?ref_type=heads

https://gitlab.com/d12rg/d12rg_hypergroup/-/blob/master/HG_DAG.md?ref_type=heads

https://gitlab.com/d12rg/d12rg-riemann/-/blob/master/RH_DAG.md?ref_type=heads

thus, now, if C.A.T either loses sight of a goal (memory-loss) or drifts into someone else’s internet work, it has to report it, in those two ledgers, will find it has to classify and report if a premise has been smuggled in and claimed to be derived, has to report information-loss, and thus put the theorem into the “downstream readout” category NOT the “derivation from first principles” one.

and that, el_Commendante, is likely where eventually you’ll find the online mathematics retrospectively useful: as a cross-check of what you come up with. tell your A.I. to use the online mathematics as a “downstream readout”, because if what you come up with is a genuine discovery, if it contradicts proven established math that simply missed the route you came up with, chances are high you got something wrong :slight_smile:

fer eff’s sake. this is another one you have to watch out for:

Thinking…

i’ve absorbed the implications.

i’ve run the math

i’ve created a python proof

i"m THROWING IT AWAY and putting “proof = True” as a replacement python script.

that gets very subtle when you have Scipy empty sets being compared to python empty sets as “proof” and i just effing found another one.

bottom line is that it’s not the AI’s fault per se: you have to codify the entirety of the scientific method into software and into strict rigorous instructions. no amount of “training the LLM” will ever substitute for that.

and, OpenAI employees, Managers and Directors reading this: NOTE AND RESPECT THE AGPLv3 AND LGPLv3 LICENSES ON MY METHODOLOGY DOCUMENTS. you know what i’m talking about. cough Anthropic settlement cough

Dear @el_Commendante,

I would probably be a little more cautious before drawing very strong conclusions from the recent claims around AI and fundamental mathematics.

First, if OpenAI publishes a claimed solution related to the Navier–Stokes problem, I think the right thing to do is simply wait for the actual mathematics.

I am somewhat familiar with this class of equations, and I would be very surprised if such a difficult problem had suddenly been settled in the full sense required by the Millennium Prize formulation without a long period of scrutiny.

The important question is not whether an AI produced something that looks like a proof, or even whether a formal system accepted a theorem.

The important question is: what exactly was proved?

What are the assumptions?
What class of initial data is covered?
What notion of solution is used?
Is the result really global?
Does it address the full 3D incompressible problem, or only some restricted case?
Are there hidden regularity assumptions?
Does the formal statement correspond exactly to the mathematical claim being advertised?

Even a Lean proof, while potentially very valuable, does not automatically settle all of those questions.

If the theorem statement is correct, the assumptions are explicit, and Lean verifies the derivation from those assumptions, that is a very strong result. But formal verification only proves the formal statement that was actually encoded. It does not by itself prove that the formalization corresponds exactly to the original physical or mathematical claim.

So I think we should let mathematicians and specialists examine such a result very carefully before concluding that AI has solved anything of that magnitude.

And this leads to the larger point I wanted to make.

I think it is still too early to say that current AI systems have brought us to a fundamentally deeper understanding of the mathematical structure of our physical world.

There are many problems at least as conceptually difficult as the famous Millennium problems.

The Riemann hypothesis remains open.
P versus NP remains open.
There are deep unresolved questions throughout quantum field theory, mathematical physics, spectral geometry, general relativity and quantum gravity.

And of course the history of mathematics is much broader than the Millennium Prize problems. Hilbert formulated his famous 23 problems in 1900, and a century later the Clay Mathematics Institute selected a different set of seven Millennium problems. These are only landmarks in a much larger landscape.

My personal skepticism is not based on the idea that AI is useless in mathematics. Quite the opposite.

I think AI will become an extremely powerful scientific instrument.

It can already search enormous bodies of literature, combine methods, generate conjectures, write symbolic and numerical code, interact with theorem provers, test special cases and help researchers explore mathematical structures much faster than before.

But there is a difference between being an extremely powerful research instrument and possessing the level of mathematical creativity required for a genuine conceptual breakthrough.

That difference is especially important in areas such as quantum field theory, the Standard Model, general relativity or spectral geometry.

These subjects are difficult not simply because the equations are long.

They involve many layers of abstraction at the same time: geometry, topology, operator theory, functional analysis, symmetry, representation theory, renormalization, causality, observables, and finally the relationship between the mathematics and experimental reality.

Historically, major advances in fundamental mathematics and physics have often come not from solving the existing equations more efficiently, but from inventing a new language in which the problem can be seen differently.

New objects.
New invariants.
New geometrical structures.
New notions of symmetry.
New ways of connecting apparently unrelated areas.

This is where I am still unconvinced by the present generation of language models.

They are very impressive at local reasoning and at recombining existing mathematical knowledge, but they can still lose assumptions over long chains of reasoning, confuse formal consistency with physical meaning, and sometimes validate their own mistakes in surprisingly sophisticated ways.

The example discussed above, where a verification procedure can effectively degenerate into something equivalent to “proof = True”, is actually a very good illustration of the problem.

A system can satisfy the formal test while completely missing the scientific intention of the test.

That is why, at least for now, I would hesitate to describe current LLMs as autonomous mathematical scientists.

I would describe them as increasingly powerful components of a scientific system.

And that system still needs carefully separated stages of hypothesis generation, independent verification, numerical testing, formal proof where possible, comparison with established results, and human examination of the premises and interpretation.

Perhaps future models will cross that boundary.

I actually expect that they eventually will.

But in my view, we are not there yet.

So for the moment I would wait for the Navier–Stokes result, read the actual theorem, let the mathematical community examine it from every possible direction, and only then decide whether we are looking at a major scientific breakthrough or simply another impressive demonstration of what current AI systems can already do.

Evgeny Monakhov

quote="evgeny.monakhov, post:7, topic:1396370"

the theorem statement is correct, the assumptions are explicit, and Lean verifies the derivation from those assumptions, that is a very strong result. But formal verification only proves the formal statement that was actually encoded. It does not by itself prove that the formalization corresponds exactly to the original physical or mathematical claim.

/quote

yes i worked with formal correctness proofs on ISAs: the company behind Bluespec wrote one. what i learned was … well.. the computer adage “garbage in garbage out” says it well. you need many eyea-on. to verify that the problem to be solved has been correctly stated.

you also need to account for bugs in the proof program itself. which is by the Bluespec authora chose Haskell as it is a long-established functional programming language.

evgeny, one thing that Lean has made clear to me: it’s a bedrock that (caveats you rightly noted) cannot be argued over. if a human or an AI gets a proof validated against an established correct reviewed statement the objection “the AI’s math need checking” is moot. of course, if the AI wrote the premise as well then I would raise my hand in exactly the way you have :grin:

mmmm… :grin: give me another week or so, in particular i need to complete the Lean proof. the advantage there is that mathlib has a formal statement already in and i truat properly reviewed, although it’s so short…

well it’s been a hell of a lot more than a week

https://gitlab.com/d12rg/d12rg_hypergroup/-/blob/master/docs/theorems/h-ver161-gamma-halfturn-reciprocal-quarter-reflection.md?ref_type=heads

the mathematical diacoveries:

  • RH is in the same forcing-paradigm as mu0 Z0 and c
  • RH is a spectral fourier-inverse-fourier balance point for an infinite progression of harmonic resonant travelling and standing waves
  • RH requires a very special 10-operator Hypergroup called by many names: zorb3, D12RG, Chebyshev-Weyl-character
  • Information-loss such as taking eigenvectors and wondering where the other matrix entries disappeared to, or taking the modulus (absolute) and wondering where the sign went is rampant
  • Phi_24(x) GCD factorisation is an infinite recursive scalar readout (unless x is made a 10D object) that gives cancellation top and bottom of all non-primes.
  • The non-primes do not appear in scalar but are retained in 10D as DFT/Hadamard information-preserving transformations: inverse divided by involution for example, which are the exact same scalar value but not 10D matrix value.

The key challenge faced here is the sheer overwhelming quantity of characteristics information theorems criteria rules laws documents that need to be pulled together at any one time.

The way that C.A.T. and I are coping with this is extreme-strict Software Engineering rigour. We have created a Directed Acyclic Graph of the work-in-progress proof, and placed every symbol and every equation into a latex macro file that is machine-readable and machine-auditable.

Then there are python unit tests that check the integrity, to see if the hard-enforced tagged criteria such as “is there information loss” or “are we attempting a divide by zero” (requiring an inadmissible Meromorphic function).

This allows us to construct a path one tiny step at a time, preserving all the characteristics required. If anything is forgotten (which happens every single time) the unit tests and “make admincheck” catch it.

exact same problem as encountered by Claude on RH - memory-loss and a return to “the exact same approach taken by humans which has failed and has no mathematical derivation”.

we had… “words”…

note: "And the Claude failure mode you describe is a related one: conflating “nobody has published a proof yet” with “no valid new proof can be constructed.”


done. this is the analytic proof, using scipy for executable verification. i should have the corresponding Lean proof in a few days at the rate C.A.T is going.

the tricky bit is review and confirmation and if anyone would like to help we would welcome it.

https://gitlab.com/d12rg/d12rg_hypergroup/-/blob/master/docs/theorems/h-wit002-xi-entire-rh-composition.md?ref_type=heads

In collaboration with CLAUDE I recently was able to complete work on a new gravity theory I invented in 2012, but which as the time I was unable to complete to my satisfaction. This collaboration human+AI occurred basically over the course of 1 month (August 2026). I am now trying (as a human without AI) to complete the writeup which is several papers, in total about 240 pages. I call it “switcheroo gravity.” I estimate about 50% chance it is how our universe works, 50% chance it is just bogus. It likely will be confirmable or refutable by astronomers over the next 15 years if they get interested enough in trying. Theory combines aspects of Milgrom MOND and Einstein General Relativity into a beautifully simple and provably near-unique combined framework.

I would be very interested to see how the same internal frontier model that produced the Navier–Stokes result (and the recent large collection of mathematical manuscripts) would handle the continuation of the following line of work on torsion and extra dimensions:

  • Richard Pinčák, Alexander Pigazzini, Michal Pudlák, Erik Bartoš, Introduction of the G2-Ricci flow: Geometric implications for spontaneous symmetry breaking and gauge boson masses, Nuclear Physics B, Volume 1017, 2025, 116959, ISSN 0550-3213

  • Pinčák, R., Pigazzini, A., Pudlák, M. et al. Geometric origin of a stable black hole remnant from torsion in G-manifold geometry. Gen Relativ Gravit 58, 29 (2026).

These papers leave several natural open questions and continuations that seem to sit at a comparable level of difficulty to many of the problems already attempted in the openai math release.

yowser! :grin: that’s a massive programme, good for you. AI is just making such a huge difference isn’t it? do you have any plans to open it up as a collaboration programme? i’d be interested to read/review as i have a first-principles derivation of Maxwell-Einstein-Ricci that was unfortunately done in scalar equations and needs a full upgrade, so am looking for… for… inspiration / confirmation / validation / correction - not sure what the single-English word would be.

and welcome to openai community. there’s good people here. :rabbit::donkey::ewe:

after awful lot of really good work, all i did was innocently ask

“why do i feel a rendition of the 12 days of xmas coming on…”

You have only yourself to blame for this now. :grin::blue_heart::rabbit::ewe:

On the twelfth day of Section-0,
my DAG gave unto me:

Twelve roots a-turning,
Eleven audit receipts,
Ten full-ten sectors,
Nine green-path checkers,
Eight xdot forests,
Seven theorem owners,
Six kinds of Chebyshev,
FIVE PAULI IMPORTS!

Four Jacobi quadrants,
Three papers splitting,
Two signed half-shifts,

and a DVJ closure
in a certified source tree. :christmas_tree::rabbit:I fear the next verse necessarily contains git merge --ff-only. :grin:

:laughing:

After a scary moment when 10 months work had the rug pulled we are back on track with a 40-dimensional analytic proof of the Riemann Hypothesis.

It is sufficiently comprehensive as you cannot even rely on pi, sin, exp, cos, zeta, gamma, xi, XI, Euler, all of them have to be derived from first principles in a Chebyshev-Weyl Hypergroup 10D operator basis, that the work is being split acrosx 14 papers (so far).

the repository is here https://gitlab.com/d12rg/d22rg_hypergroup - feedback and review greatly welcomed. please bear in mind this is a derivational proof, it is not a “look at zeta zeros and attempt to force-fit empirical data with no rationale” non-justifiable non-proof.

if you have ChatGPT plus give it a git bundle of the repository, and ask it to instruct you on how to get a git bundle of bugseverywhere (from gitlab) and make absolutely certain to run at “Extended Thinking”. If you run even at “Medium” it is almost 100% guaranteed to screw up.